[Sirene]

Trying to figure out how to put all the events and timeline(s) together in a realistic way has developed into a very amusing discussion! I wish Robin had kept his view to himself though, because I like it when there is no obvious right or wrong interpretation…

And if you for a moment silence your wish for logic and reason there is a layer of a more poetic and emotional nature in this story to be discovered:

Old Thorgal feels that the world he knew is no longer.  (Because his beloved Aaricia is no more, this is a reality in which he doesn’t want to be part)

He wishes he was able to go back. (The temptation would be irresistible!).

He is angry with this fate, speculating other choices or deeds could have made a difference. (He would even kill in cold blood, if it could bring her back!)

Deep down he realizes that whatever he tried it would only give him pain in the end. (Nothing would change, she would still be dead.)

Finally accepting what has passed, his life is at a new beginning; a journey on his own, to unknown destinies. (Like a young Thorgal ready to sail.)

Something gives him confidence that it will be all right – but different. (Her love will follow him where ever he goes)

Logic and reason back on:
In the end, everything could have been a dream of old Thorgal who fell asleep at that beach while watching the flames devour the drakkar. A dream combining many past memories and intertwining them with the different stages of sorrow. The story wouldn’t be less real or honest if it indeed all was a dream, because some Thorgal albums take place in his own mind without obvious seams.

• Cette réponse a été modifiée le il y a 2 années et 9 mois par Sirene.
• Cette réponse a été modifiée le il y a 2 années et 9 mois par Sirene.

[Sirene]

Of course Thorgal is attracted to Kriss’ appearance. That doesn’t mean he’s attracted to her personality – on the contrary.

The first time Thorgal and Tjall sees her they say:
-Say that girl is superb!
-A wild cat’s beauty Tjall, mind her claws.

[Sirene]

Looks very very promising, I’m very enthusiastic!
Nice composition of dark silent boxes and explosive emotions.

I noticed a small similarity in the last box of the ‘prelude’ and the first page of Adieu Aaricia (album HERE )
There are two boats, in the first we see the mast break down from the fire, in the second there is a boat with a broken mast lying on the  shore. It’s the kind of detail that doesn’t have a meaning in the story per se, but for the reader it enhances the air of connection and time going in circles.

[Sirene]

This picture from Alaska shows the frame of a traditional umiak, a boat also used by Inuits in Greenland. Its made of whale bone, probably because wood is hard to find in these areas. A bit mindboggling, the harsh conditions in which people actually live and lived. The arch reminds me of the album cover for Tupilaks.

[Sirene]

The bright colours of Gaétan Georges picture differ a bit from the colours we are used to in Thorgal, which could be an additional reason to believe it is not depicting anything « real », but either a memory, a dream, something imagined… or a (false?) vision to lure Thorgal to surrender. The white bubbles suggest someone – who isn’t in the scene –  is thinking.

[Sirene]

I was also wondering where/when this would be. The mediterranean island in Arachnea doesn’t fit with the spruce (épicéa) trees in the back, it has to be a more northern location.

[Sirene]

Lovely drawing!
But he forgot the dog, didn’t he…?

[Sirene]

Thanks Alex, maybe that last post was a bit tainted with my own sadness.
With some more perspective, I’m realizing that what Thorgal would witness going back to the times he wasn’t there would also be how strongly and bravely Aaricia always acted, refusing to give up even when (presumably) left alone in a harsh world. Yes, she might cry in her pillow at night and beg those wicked gods to bring him back… And he would be devastated to see that. But then she would also lift her blue eyes to the sky and put one foot before the other, knowing she – life – must go on. No matter what the circumstances.
And Thorgal would perhaps learn that neither can he allow himself to succumb to these feelings. Honoring Aaricias memory wouldn’t be compatible with willingly fading away (like he almost did that once). In this mature age, he would understand that his responsibilities are not finished in the world, that he must live his life to its own end. 

In that last box, it would be Thorgal who lifted his eyes to the sky.
And meet the colour of hers.

[Sirene]

Having lost a loved one recently, this theme resonates with me. 
Whether there is a Nidhoegg pushing for it or not, one cannot help but wander through past memories. Joys and sorrows coming back…
I wonder what scenes we will revisit from the life of Thorgal and Aaricia. Will he find out how much she struggled without him? What she told the children about their father when he was away for so long? Will he be able to stroke the tears of her cheeks as a prisoner of Kriss and Shaïgan?

I cannot see a happy ending here though, only bittersweet ones.

[Sirene]

Thorgal is always fighting the physical barriers of this world – climbing rocks, swimming the ocean, falling through the abyss, trodding through deep snow or swamps, flying the skies, jumping, dodging, hanging… Given he got his name from Aegir, the God of the Sea it is no surprise we also find him on a boat or raft from time to time. He knows how to dive and in The Scarlet Fire we even see him forcibly submerged in a few boxes. But I still think there is room for more underwater scenarios  for our hero. Both his mother and the ancient Atlanteans drowned – or at least were lost at sea…
Who knows what lies hidden in the depths?

« The sunken mother« ?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

An underwater god?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Atlantean artifacts? (the  Antikythera mechanism comes to mind) 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Remains of a lost people… Or religiously sacrificed victims?

 

 

 

 

 

 

Maybe the Nine daughters of Aegir /Nine wave maidens?
(Modern illustration of Kolga, the « cold-wave maiden », below)

 

 

• Cette réponse a été modifiée le il y a 3 années et 2 mois par Sirene.

[Sirene]

Nah, there’s already enough of women surrounding Thorgal. He doesn’t need a sister, he needs a good-looking brother who can give him some rest when the ladies become too eager. :)= 

Here’s another inspirational concept: The Trojaborg or Virgin Dance .

 

This is a labyrinth pattern that dates thousands of years back. It’s usually built by lined up stones or turf or carved into the soil or a rock, but one could imagine variants painted in the sand of beaches or in the snow. Trojaborgs are mainly found around the Scandinavian archipelago and the UK (under different names), and so must have played a particular role in seafarer’s lives. 

The purposes of these labyrinthic structures seem to differ through time and geolocation, here are two with a pagan vibe:

walking the stone labyrinths in the proper way gave fortune and protection, healing and magical aid – even fishermen used labyrinths in the hope of being able to control the weather and increase the catch, as well as protection against perils at sea

there are many tales as well as games where a girl is supposed to stand in the center of the labyrinth while young men have to work themselves through the winding path in order to “liberate her from her fortified prison”
(the girl is often a virgin, but is sometimes referred to as a goddess)

For more reading, here’s a start: https://bladehoner.wordpress.com/2020/01/21/labyrinths-and-ritual-in-scandinavia/

Of course, labyrinths and the myths around them are found universally – the story of the Greek Minotaur is just one example. And with the right mindset it wouldn’t be hard to translate the architectural structure to a more windling psychological challenge, as in the Invisible Fortress .

• Cette réponse a été modifiée le il y a 3 années et 2 mois par Sirene.

[Sirene]

There are so many amazing places in the world, and I’m not surprised to see some of them appear in Thorgal. 
But I was astonished to find what must have been the inspiration for the city of the Xinjins in our real world:
Mesa Verde National park

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

If I could make one of these places appear in a Thorgal album, it would perhaps be The Sunken Palace (Yerebatan Sarnıcı, found in Istanbul, but in fiction it could be anywhere). It looks like a palace, but it’s a water cistern so there’s water on the « floors ».

[Sirene]

I have this feeling that eating in Thorgal is often followed by danger. As if eating means you have lowered your guard, and then disaster hits… Maybe I’m wrong generally, but clearly the poor hero in the Sun Sword who enjoys that beer so much will wake up surrounded by guards.
Also, there’s some subtile humour when food is around. In the invisible fortress, Thorgal snaps some food from one of his villains who is locked in a time freeze.  😆 

And do they eat anything but these poor rabbits? It’s like the favourite dish in the Aegirsson house. Can’t recall seeing any of those wild boars Obelix is so found of, or even a hen.

[Sirene]

A board game that has never been done before? Yep, you managed to make me curious as well!

[Sirene]

Thorgal-BD wrote
I replaced « Suggestion box for future scripts » by « Suggestion box for future albums »?

Thanks Stefan. 🙂
I’d love to put inspirational seeds in the heads of Thorgal creators – and fans too! My ambition is low-key, I’d find it very cool just to help spark the creation of a box, a name, or a line of dialogue.
And I’m not worried at all about plagiarism. We have already seen in Thorgal how it is possible to create unique stories within the setting of previously told ones. There are obvious influences from the Odessy, from Star Wars, from LoTR, from Wilhelm Tell and others… But these are enjoyable, recognizable bits or themes, and it is the way that classical storytelling is made. You lend something and add something.

Ah, yes Thorgal is a lot about characters and psychology, and I’d love for him to have a brother. Not necessarily a powerful one (because then he would be shortlived!), but maybe one who has made other choices than Thorgal. Maybe an outcast among Atlanteans? 

• Cette réponse a été modifiée le il y a 3 années et 2 mois par Sirene.
• Cette réponse a été modifiée le il y a 3 années et 2 mois par Sirene.
• Cette réponse a été modifiée le il y a 3 années et 2 mois par Sirene.

[Sirene]

Beautiful! It’s a bit hard to see in these pictures, but I love that we see Aaricias face blending in with the dark sky.

[Sirene]

Thorgal shares a lot with Islandic sagas and Norse myths (Asgard), and now in the latest albums we have seen themes from Scotland/Faeroes (Selkie) and Greenland (Tupilak). 
What next?
May I suggest some Finnish mythology?

The Kalevala epos offers some interesting heroes, places, objects and storylines that I think few people outside this part of the world know about. Though, both Tolkien and C.S. Lewis are said to have drawn inspiration from it.
More reading can be found at Kalevala Wikipedia (French).

And to raise your interest, here’s an illustration of the battle against the northern witch Louhi about the mysterious (Atlantean??) artefact Sampo.

[Sirene]

I’d like to expand the topic of this thread a little, and maybe change the title to « Inspiration for authors & artists » . I have plenty of ideas in various forms, but not specifically on scenarios. I’d rather share pictures, myths, places, people that could inspire authors and artists to create new breathtaking adventures for us to enjoy.
Stephan, maybe you could consider renaming the thread or make a new one with a name that makes it irresistible to read for our intended audience(?) 

Here goes:
Place: An inspiring photo of Segla mountain on Senja island, Norway. Note the small village below on the left. 
There are even more stunning pictures of this place on the Internet, with snow/mist/at dusk.
What’s at the top if it? Who knows…

Person: Estrid Sigfastsdotter
Mighty Viking woman who lived around 1000 in Scandinavia. Left behind many runestones that can be seen today. She travelled herself to Germany, and her sons travelled even more far away, to Jerusalem. Her remains were found intact in Sweden, and a reconstruction of her appearance have been made as shown below. There is also a reconstruction with a more young appearance to be found. Maybe she shows up in a village near Thorgal soon? 

[Sirene]

Cat a écrit
Otherwise, I would love an adventure where Thorgal would awaken his Atlantean powers

I’m 5 years late on commenting on your post Cat, but what a great Thorgal story you’ve written! Wish I could have had it as an album and not just as a story plot. I love the idea of Thorgal having to accept Shaïgan as a part of him, to become whole again – very clever, very Thorgalesque. The story rather fits the category of « fanfiction » and not « ideas », because it’s very complete. 
Thank you for sharing!

[Sirene]

Different cover for Portuguese comic (possibly just combining several pictures):
I wonder why they choose to give Xargos  red hair instead of white on the frontpage?

• Cette réponse a été modifiée le il y a 3 années et 3 mois par Sirene.
• Cette réponse a été modifiée le il y a 3 années et 3 mois par Thorgal-BD.

[Sirene]

Giving flesh and bone to this Bash character, what would he look like?
Handsome? Yes.
Resembling Thorgal? Possibly.
Wearing the typical Atlantean spandex suit? No! No way!

I first laughed at this portrait you gave us Ralph; a Bash with a pirate eye patch and all.
But then I realized the idea has potential…

Ralf a écrit

A one-eyed brother would by appearance tell us he’d already been through hardships. Giving his ship 8 legs would sooner or later make someone in here think about Odin and Sleipner and we would have discussions on Bash not being an Atlantean at all but a mischievous divine being putting our poor Thorgal up for more tests and temptations…
-Would you come with me? To leave this planet of greedy people and arrogant Gods!

Slive also lost one of her eyes, but unfortunately I haven’t read the album explaining how it happened. Hadn’t that story already been written, I would have made this loss of an eye the mark of an Atlantean punishment. It would be intriguing if both Bash and Slive were regarded as criminals or outcasts by some of their people, and it would (again) tell us that the Atlanteans are not as civilized as they appear. 

[Sirene]

If we want more strange coincidences to happen I’d say we continue pouring out inspirational posts and pictures.
And if coincidences don’t happen, well… Then at least we had fun trying.  :oui: 

#UnFrèrePourThorgal
#GiveThorgalABrother

[Sirene]

I recommend any Thorgal reader here to at least check some figures and their corresponding descriptions in this paper.
(It must have been a challenge to discriminate both characters and scenes in certain albums!)

Here’s two of the references that also are worth reading (first one in French and possibly already discussed here, the second in English):

[15] Thorgal, une masculinité « douce » comme modèle pour la jeunesse
https://www.cairn.info/revue-agora-debats-jeunesses-2018-1-page-67.htm 
Pierrick Desfontaine, Prune Mesyngier, Jean-Nicolas Renaud
Dans Agora débats/jeunesses 2018/1 (N° 78), pages 67 à 85

[54] Reshaping the scandinavian saga through hybridity: “Thorgal”, an anti-mythological hero
https://dial.uclouvain.be/pr/boreal/object/boreal:219470/datastream/PDF_01/view
Thiry, M., International Congress of Medieval Studies (2019), 

[Sirene]

What if this brother, Bash, actually came looking for his parent/s on Earth? Thinking of it, it would be more natural if he was Thorgal’s halfbrother because otherwise he would have accompanied all the other family members on their space ship. And wouldn’t it be more interesting if they had this brotherly bond on beautiful Hayneés side…
Bash would despise Varth for parting him from his mother, maybe even knowing he was going to arrange a mutiny.

-So Thorgal, you are the son of Varth? And you tell me he saved himself while letting my mother perish to the waves… (tension)

Even before the crash, Thorgal would sense his brothers distorted thoughts. That is why he leaves the village alone to witness the crash of the ship. But what next?

Thorgal walks closer to the unknown vessel. Boom! An explosion strikes him unconscious, a wound pouring blood over his face. Soon Bash emerges from the inside, with a minor bandage over his face. He has a striking resemblance to our hero, but at this point nobody notices. There’s another wounded here, bring him in! Bash, too curious to stay, leaves in the direction of the village where he believes to find some Atlantean inhabitants. There, he is first confused with Thorgal which gives us plenty of inspiration to explore the new relationships. If he is not Thorgal, maybe he is Shaigan? 😯 

There could be some initial hostility, but in the end the brothers need each other to get some kind of closure. I’d love to see this manly relationship unfold, but do not know how.
Maybe they set off on a joint venture to find the remains of Hayneé.

• Cette réponse a été modifiée le il y a 3 années et 3 mois par Sirene.

[Sirene]

I don’t know if this is humour, but I found it pretty amusing when I noticed it. If you don’t read these two albums directly after each other, you may not spot it at all…

Thorgal has grown quite a long beard in the start of the album The Sun Sword/L’Épée-Soleil.
When he first meets Kriss in the rebel camp, she tells him (in her usual patronizing way):
-Hmm.. After some thought I think I prefer you without the beard.
They very soon part ways as the adventure goes on, and the beard hangs on to the last pages of that album where they again reunite. At this point, Thorgal is still annoyed about the attention he gets from this deceitful and unreliable companion. Ahm, or maybe he is annoyed about her being very, very beautiful and him having these strange mixed feelings? 

Anyway, in the next album (La Forteresse invisible) we find the couple waking up at a river bank after what seems to be one of their first nights on their own. And what does Thorgal do, for the first time in weeks? 
He shaves!

No wonder Kriss smirks so much.  😀 

[Sirene]

Robin, you’ve had two years to tell Farewell Aaricia – and now already you say Goodbye Thorgal!?  😡 
No, I think you will learn that it is hard to stop once you’ve had a love affair with this guy. 

[Sirene]

I agree, it’s not very thorgalian to slap a woman even if she deserves it!
But I always thought that the reason Thorgal tries to stop Kriss is because she is deliberately torturing the rapists to death instead of quickly killing them.
Thorgal and Kriss are both very young in this adventure and more impulsive than in the latter albums, it’s not necessarily inconsistent but more of a natural development. And for the incident with Ewing, this act marks the beginning of a mental break-down of our hero. 

• Cette réponse a été modifiée le il y a 3 années et 3 mois par Sirene.

[Sirene]

Thorgal certainly has some amazing powers. First of course, he has this uncanny skill of always staying alive no matter what dire circumstances he finds himself in. But he also sees things others don’t, talks to Gods and mythical beasts, travels to other dimensions, senses dangers, hears telepathical messages…
It’s not always clear if these ‘powers’ rely on:

• his extraordinary character and physique
• his Atlantean inborn powers
• Atlantean technology/items
• the wishes of the gods and existing magical pathways
• a combination of the above

But to be able to appreciate Thorgal as a hero, we need him to express what’s under bullet no 1 above. Otherwise, he will just be a nobody who is lucky – which would make a very dull story. It’s when he makes the hard but good choices, pressed by threats and fate, that we admire him. 

Did Xargos really need to change Thorgal’s brain to make his potential powers inaccessible for him?
Or did he just reenforce the disgust for power that Thorgal already by then must have had…

[Sirene]

I agree – for new readers the updated colouring could remove the feeling of a somewhat dated comic and add a more realistic atmosphere. It’s an investment in coming Thorgal-generations, rather than a way to pull out money from old supporters.

It’s funny, I do recall that the I wasn’t pleased with the pink colour on the vikings at my first read! But despite that, today I actually prefer the original colours. I guess it’s all about nostalgia…
Also, as long as Thorgal stays believable it doesn’t have to be all realistic. Vikings and Atlanteans are in the same room, that’s kind of more eye catching than a pink tunic. 

The only thing I can’t forgive Gaétan for (maybe I can), is that he changed the colour of the flowers Aaricia wears on her wedding day. I have no idea why that little detail bothers me so much, but they should be BLUE! 😉

[Sirene]

It all looks very promising Robin!
Ah, the grief in the beginning is unbearable, very emotional… 

• Cette réponse a été modifiée le il y a 3 années et 3 mois par Sirene.

[Sirene]

It’s intriguing how many actors you found that actually would fit as Thorgal!
Viggo Mortensen and Clive Owen are not bad and there were plenty of other roles casted in this thread that were spot on.
Maybe in the future AI will make it possible to combine all our favourite actors in the same movie, regardless of their actual age. 

For the Thorgal role audition, here’s another suggestion (with the help of AI):

And for the Keeper of the Keyes, a young Cher:

[Sirene]

I’m amazed, both by the original story idea of Thorgal having a brother crashing onto earth and by Ralphs excellent design(s). 
I want this album, badly!
The cover with Thorgal looking up in the sky is just perfect. Colours, composition, title!
Very well done, I hope we get to see more from you Ralph.  :love:

Knowing Thorgal’s relatives almost too well by now, it’s time for a family addition – or possibly an adjustment?
Thorgal hasn’t had a male friend since Tjall, and having a real brother appear… I don’t think we have seen any kind of bromance in these albums yet? Yes, the obvious story would of course involve a « Bad Boy » Bash, just like Varth and almost every male we have encountered so far is an antagonist. But the unexpected storylines are often the most appreciated within this community. 

[Sirene]

It’s amusing to see Thorgal interpreted into other universes. I am sure someone here would know what Lego minifigures would fit the Thorgalian saga…
With Duplo, there is a very limited range of figures to choose from for our heroes and villains. At least some of the matches are decent, enjoy! 

Thorgal (young and as adult)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Aaricia

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Jolan

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Louve

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Varth

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Jadawan

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Tjahzi

 

 

 

 

 

Shania

• Cette réponse a été modifiée le il y a 3 années et 3 mois par Sirene.

[Sirene]

Hello, what’s the opinion on members writing comments in another language (obviously English for my part)?
Allowed? Unwanted? Impractical? Not an issue at all?

Thanks to automated translating services I’m able to read and understand almost all comments and take part of this excellent Thorgal forum. But I’ve been hesitant to add any comments as the little French I once learned doesn’t allow me to discuss things like the Viking era, paper quality or sea vessels…

[Auteur]

Messages